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Would you replace your existing internet provider with a community-based ISP, assuming that you'd (at the very least) keep the same speed? If so/not, why?

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ยท Mastalab ยท 62 ยท 180 ยท 61

@GigaByte4711 more incentive to do their "best" if they're the ones using it, right?

@brandon
Exactly. Running it as a not-for-profit means that the goal of the service is to provide the best internet service possible, not to make as much money as possible.

When you know that your provider's key metric is satisfaction, not sales, that's when you're doing it right.

You also get transparency in the financials and costs of the company.

@GigaByte4711 Iโ€™d worry it would turn into someoneโ€™s opportunity to be in charge and/or a hobby for people who like committee meetings... so maybe not?

@ghost_bird

Fair. If it was a not-for-profit company set up for this reason, backed by community funding, do you think that would alleviate that sort of bureaucracy?

@GigaByte4711 Maybe? Thereโ€™s plenty of drama in not-for-profit companies too, but it would at least have a mitigating effect.

@GigaByte4711 (Actually, thatโ€™s probably too negative. Running it as a company could work pretty well, as long as the oversight mechanisms were set up properly.)

@GigaByte4711 I would want to see specs and how it works before id say yes. And id like to see tye price tag and how it would be paid.

@GigaByte4711 if you are talking about towns that start their own ISP and lay down their own infrastructure then id really only want to see price and how it will be paid for and restrictions of its use

@GigaByte4711

Of course I would, even if it was a mess and poorly run it would still make commercial ISPs at least try a little to be consumer friendly out of alarm.

@GigaByte4711 My current provider constantly has issues, including constant "interruptions" that are unexplained

@GigaByte4711 It introduces competitive pricing for different speed ranks, and if it has reliable funding, ensures access or budget relaxation for poorer consumers. The only concern would be internal policy--hopefully a community ISP would be more privacy & security focused than regular ISPs. no guarantees tho.

@mrjunge

As soon as you start peering directly with exchanges, you can bypass any snooping that local ISPs can carry out.

A community ISP can also come up with its own monitoring rules, choose how to anonymise their logs, and show transparency with their DNS/filtering policies. They can also publish how they protect the privacy of the customers using their services.

@GigaByte4711 Absolutely. ISPs know they can get away with murder because they usually only have one competitor in a market, and there's almost always collusion to keep prices high.

A non-profit driven provider would burst the bubble and force other ISPs to charge what the service is worth, and would almost always be better in terms of customer service.

@GigaByte4711
Probably a lot less price bumping for no reason. There would be more visibility into the challenges it's facing and the community could be able to help fix and improve itself. It would also probably just be better.

@GigaByte4711 I probably wouldn't because we've been using RCN and they've pretty great. If we were still with Verizon/Time Warner I'd switch to anything else in a heartbeat, though.

@GigaByte4711 @DissidentKitty I wish that were an option. My provider is only one that offers comparable speed to my building so they screw me on price because they know they can.

@GigaByte4711 I'd opt for "maybe" - I'd definitely need more information about such a service before I could make a decision either way, such as price, speed, contention, services offered, traffic prioritisation methods used, etc.

@GigaByte4711 It's a nice thought. But in America the last-mile connection run is generally monopolized by cable or telephone companies with an embargo against having communities/government run their own last-mile/ISP level connection. So I would say "Yes" even though in my state it is illegal.:)

@GigaByte4711 If it's community driven it's probably more focused on important things (like privacy) instead of raw profit.

@GigaByte4711 Yes, and it would be nice if it were tax funded and made accessible to everyone.

@GigaByte4711 My ISP is pretty good actually but I'm up for trying something new and seeing how it goes.

Not the solid reasoning you're probably looking for, but that's my take.

@GigaByte4711 I'm on a municipal ISP (owned by the city) at least, and it's already a marked improvement over purely commercial ones because they actually spent the money to build a modern FTTH network even for villages with way too few people to ever be economical for the commercial providers

@elomatreb @GigaByte4711 Sure. I think communications should be treated as a public resource like roads, not something for investors to milk money from.

@lroop @GigaByte4711 It's so obvious in Germany

We privatized the telecommunications provider (what is now Deutsche Telekom / T-Mobile) in the 1990s and now we have infamously bad internet infrastructure (but the company has massive profits)

@elomatreb

@lroop

We have BT, and I'm sick of paying so much just for 57M down and 17M up.

Gigabit is quite expensive, but there are government initiatives that can pay up to ยฃ2500 toward the coat of getting fibre to a business, or a community (minimum 10 people served)

I was considering the cost of approaching my local council to put forward the idea of a village-based WISP that could provide up to 100Mb to each home.

@GigaByte4711 my ISP is sky and they suck ass with servers / router rules

@GigaByte4711

I voted "yes", but I would prefer if "community" meant the city government.

A locally owned ISP business would be my second choice.

I'd be nervous of any neighborhood-run non-profit. I'd worry that it would be run by the same sort of people who want to be on an HOA committee so they can judge their neighbors.

@apLundell

I was considering the cost of approaching my local council to put forward the idea of a village-based WISP that could provide up to 100Mb to each home.

The idea of setting up a nonprofit for it might keep it out of the hands of people that like meetings, etc.

@GigaByte4711

I'm in USA, and I'm not sure if city councils fill exactly the same role in US and UK, but if the local city council set up an internet service, I would be the first in line.

If someone ran for a council seat on a "Local Internet For Our City" platform, I would absolutely vote for them.

@GigaByte4711
No, because anything that's community based always goes to shit.

@GigaByte4711 what is a "community based ISP"? How does it work? How does it differ from a corporate ISP? Are there already some in existence? What are the users saying? I'm asking because I never knew such a thing existed (or might).

@GigaByte4711 i would do so even with lower speed as long as it is cheap and rather reliable ยฏ\_(ใƒ„)_/ยฏ

also symmetric up- and download-rates, and longlasting public ips!

@GigaByte4711 In fact, we already do use a community network โ€” KPUD in Kitsap County, Washington. They were the only ones who could bring us Internet after Comcast and CenturyLink both failed to bring any form of broadband to most of the county.

@GigaByte4711 Yes,absolutely.I don't think that my provider is that bad.Well,there are so many worse options.But after all it's still a for-profit company and if I get the same quality for not too expensive prices,I always try to support community projects.

caps 

@GigaByte4711
For me, all started as community ISPs.

We, as kids, connected using cables and cheapest switches. The cable sticking out of the window, going to roof, roofs connected by another cables.

It always started as LAN, and someone had internet and shared.

The LAN was unreliable AF (say, one PC shutdown often meant half network down), and when real, "business" ISPs came - people quickly switched..

@GigaByte4711 no because I already use a community based ISP. It's both cheaper and faster

@GigaByte4711
Is this Tor but ISP?
I think this was the idea about internet where it all started, yet we have large businesses controlling it now and like Google and stuff

@GigaByte4711
My existing ISP is not community-based, but very local and that's a very good thing. We even have our own local network where people set up shared folders and shit. And prices are cheap. There's so much benefits and 0 drawbacks.

@GigaByte4711 a whole host of reasons namely that I could have a say in what happens and make sure it remains private and secure, I'd actually be interesting in helping run one and setting up infrastructure

@GigaByte4711
Been toying aroubnd with the idea of founding an internet service co-op with some friends. We live in an area with a lot of IT/engineering people and quite a few seem interested.

@GigaByte4711 there's insufficient information to make a decision. It would still be important to know who has access to the infrastructure and how those people are vetted, and how reliably one can expect them to fix and prevent outages. Also, it would be good to know about upgrade plans for the future.

For my current ISP I know all of those things. If they were community run, I wouldn't mind at all.

@GigaByte4711
Yes, but I'd be jumping ship as soon as the reliability falls.

Mayyyyybe I'd have both as redundancy

@GigaByte4711
In 90s and 00s we had providers that were very local, couple of districts. They formed local networks and local communities. Those were times!

I miss those times.

@drq @GigaByte4711 we even had this in 2010-2012. I remember local forum, DC+ hubs and so. :)

Then ISP added unlimited Internet access at same cost and all of this just died in year, maybe less.

@GigaByte4711 Honestly no. It makes invasions of privacy much more impactful if its localized.

@GigaByte4711 Assuming it would mean #privacy is respected and the traffic of users wouldn't be logged, tracked, or otherwise monitored, then it's the *only* sane option.

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